Some opponents such as wizard or rogue stand at one edge of the map and cast spells that can reach the entire map, before you can even get near them, you are already dead. They dont move which means you never get a chance to attack, and I think this is unbalanced.
Yes i already noticed that alot of time… also that break often my win streak… im curious how they do that its not fair…
Well, those builds are mostly Glasscannon builds with the AI set to run away at max yards and start spamming, sometimes coupled with knockback or stun. Can be countered by blink-type builds.
They are working on a balance patch soon. It was pretty hard ranking up vs those players.
You can bypass them with blinkstrike (btw blinkstrike can bypass anything lol)
The range of any ranged skill can’t go further than the limit of the screen
So about balancing, what things would you change/balance? which class is stronger than the others and why?
There are plenty of ways to deal with this.
Reflect DMG+Trophy skill (preferably silence or slow)
These kinds of enemies are one of the easiest to beat as they just spam 1 attack and are extremely vulnerable to AoE skills since they do not move.
I would change their AI a little such that they wont be allowed to camp at one spot and fire spells indefinitely. At this point, I would like to add on that because of proc spells such as Storm, even if you get near them with teleport skills the multiple pro cs that surround them would kill you in one hit.
Also, while I admit that the solutions posted below will work, not everybody has access to these skills-especially because everybody wants to play their own way. I personally do not have blink because I play a Wizard, using Manashield for defence which means teleport is out of the question too.
In addition, perhaps ‘getting tankier’ is a possible solution, but I am sure you are aware that when you are up against an enemy with 6 mythic equips at common league, you probably are going to have a bad day. Perhaps the matching could be adjusted so that it is a fair fight as well.
Also, perhaps forfeiting could have less dire consequences if you face such an enemy. In the case where enemies are firing infinite spells in your general direction, I believe the wise thing to do is to wait until they are out of mana. Unfortunately due to opponents massive MP leech this usually doesnt happen. Personally I feel this is a rather dishonorable way to win a match. When faced with such a hopeless situation, perhaps forfeiting can be considered as a strategy, however currently forfeiting causes you to lose by default, which deducts points, lose your streak, as well as receive a letter which deducts even more points.
Thank you for taking the time to read this, TLDR, I am not too keen on building a character just to defeat these camping AIs in PvP, because you never know when they may pop up, and such a specific build changes my playstyle completely. Id like to see a fair fight with my own equipments against AIs that don’t camp. Thanks again.
Get tankier = Useless if they use things like knockback, you can have 1m HP you’ll still be pushed.
Enigma = Yeah
Vanish = Yeah
Cyclone = Not sure
Apocalypse = Not sure
Blinkstrike = Yeah, ofc, “blinkstrike”
Shatter = Yeah, depends of the range
Stealth = Yeah, ofc, “stealth”
Meteor+Aftermath = Not sure about the range
Mirror Image = Not sure about that, images die too quickly, you should invest too much to have like 5 images, and not every classes do it
Command = Yeah, totally
Taunt = Yeah, totally, if you can reach him to put taunt on him
Twister = Can be possible to do something with that
Timewarp = Not really, at least a big nope for ranged char, but might be good coupled to a teleport/blinkstrike
Skulldraga = Not sure about The range
Shield wall = A big nope, not useful at all in this kind of configuration even if you’re making huge investment in tankiness + shieldwall, already tried
Thank you for your feedback. Please understand that we will not implement something to prevent the AI from camping. Many players will win by all means necessary, that includes Camping + Kiting. The AI is intended to mimic the player’s desires as much as possible.
All chars can get Blink and Shatter, hence why I listed them under all chars. It is intended that some builds will counter others. Camping is a valid tactic in all competitive games. If you refuse to change yourself, then you can’t blame anyone else for losing. Adapting to the metagame is part of all competitive environments.
The only way to make everything a “fair fight” is to make every class melee. The moment you introduce a Ranged char, Kiting and Camping will always be introduced. If you are having trouble with a camping char, how will you deal with a kiting one?
Until the devs release a balance patch, there is not much else you can do. It is because of situations like these that I disagreed with Wiz’ projectiles seeking (Guided Shot alone is bad enough). You can’t evade seeking missiles… At least against Hatchets n Throw Sword, you can side step the projectiles. Ricochet is random so you don’t have to worry as much.
All teleporting skills have the exact same range.
Camping AIs are not the sole problem. It is when it is coupled with extreme levels of MP and HP leech that it is impossible for me with my current gear to defeat them. This is in common league, which is supposed to be the easiest mode of them all. Yet, I face opponents that have gears that clearly outshine my own.
Yes, I only have myself to blame for not playing enough.
Yes, I only have myself to blame for not investing enough time and effort to play the game competitively and change my entire gearset against specific enemies in PvP.
Yes, I only have myself to blame for trying to enjoy the game instead of grinding for PvP specific weapons and gear.
I think I understand your point now. Thank you for your kind assistance.
But not the same mechanics/cds.
Do note that as you win more consecutive battles, you will be matched with tougher and tougher opponents (eventually you will be matched with chars that outshine you). There will be an article detailing the match making system more.
We know that the matching and point system is not perfect. So please give us more feedback so that we can improve it. There are already plans to make the matching system better so your feedback will be greatly appreciated.
At the moment the system rewards winners a lot. Sadly we do not have many players in your position to give us feedback. Please answer the following questions (this is for everyone):
At which win streak do you start to face “unbeatable” chars?
Do you feel that this is too soon?
At which win streak do you think would be adaquate?
Changing this will not require a patch so giving us detailed feedback will help us make your PVP experience better. I apologize for my previous tone as I now see this is not just a balance issue but also a match making issue.
There will be more details on the match making and ranking system coming soon.
Both Blinkstrike and Shatter have 5s.
@Clogon , mind if I answer those questions too? Im currently at magic league for both 1v1 and 2v2. I have decent equips (near max affixes) since I have farmed to around floor 800+ using the weaker copies of the builds posted on this forums.
Around 20+ points.
It’s fine most of the time, since I usually only lose to Pure HP MP WD ED rogue warrior sets. Only thing that surprised me was when I was in Common League, on around 25+ points, I got matched with an Eternal League player, and needless to say I lost horribly, and I didn’t even know what hit me cause of the hidden equips. Lol.
The current streak-break is fine, I would just suggest to limit the matchmaking possibilities to maybe 2 leagues ahead of you, instead of what happened to me, common vs eternal.
Well that’s just my opinion on the matter, hope it helps.
I believe after about 7-8 wins I begin to face opponents in the magic or even rare league and above. Upon looking equipment wise, some of them even have full mythic gear. As a player who has yet to create even one of these items, it it simply overkill in the opponent’s favour. Mainly, camping can be countered with high tankiness, but their damage output even with no MP can already nearly one shot my characters.
In my opinion, matching could be tweaked to only allow you to face opponents that are in the same league, or lower to allow pvp newbies like me to climb the streak ladder. As such, I feel that yes, it is definitely too soon, in fact pitching a common leaguer with a rare leaguer is pretty much certain death.
As mentioned above, imho, if we were to be matched with opponents of the same league, it would aid the balance of the game. This way, the streak would only end when the player has truly reached his/her limit.
I have been playing DQ since early last year, and I have enjoyed the game thus far, and I do think PVP is a fun addition to the game. Although it really is frustrating to be matched against god tier opponents within 10 mins of gameplay. When this happens though, it would be nice to have the choice to concede without losing points, or be awarded points for even trying, like a “challenge pvp” situation. In this case one could be rewarded greatly for winning, and not penalized for losing.
Again, thanks for taking the time to read and reply to my opinions.
The questions are for everyone. I will move all responses to adequate thread once the article is posted.
Thank you for your response. Please understand that what league a player is in and the strength of their build are not dependent. Someone can enter PVP with really really nice gears but not like it because they like PVE. Their build is not something a noobie would have but since they only played once, they will be in common league. A different scenario is someone with not so good gear but never stops PVPing, they will rank up the leagues to unlock the gears but their strength is average.
I do agree that a newcomer facing an eternal player can be frightening and unfair. But do realize that the reason you are facing him is because you beat everyone below him! Your build is quite a good one as it is able to match up against an eternal player! Just a bit of tweeking and I am sure you will be able to beat them. I will add another question:
Eternal league and its players are designed to extremely competitive (more details later). As a low ranking player, how do you feel about being able to face them, knowing that you are only facing them because you are good at the game?
I am sure we can find a balance between keeping this game fun yet bring you a good challenge. I can see good reason not to let common and magic (maybe even rare) players not being able to face eternals. Since you are new and still learning, facing against them does not help you improve. Delaying when you face them will be quite simple. Thank you for your sugguestion. (Do note that the devs are playing the game from scratch to take notes and make 2.1 even better than 2.0. They are trying their best to get feedback from players like you so a big THANK YOU is needed here!)
Luckily these changes can be made without releasing a patch so please give us your feedback on the match making!
Just a clarification on my post, I meant 20+ points, not streak. My bad. Edited the post.
Well, imho, I laughed and felt a bit proud, I am in fact one of those players that kept on PvE until Im quite strong before I pvped, so it wasnt too surprising. On my part facing an Eternal player was fine, I just don’t want others who played the game less experience the same. I did play for months before trying out in the PvP.
Thanks for the fast reply as always.
You are just lucky I am awake at 4 am, XD!
Gonna sleep now. Once more, thank you for the detailed response! It is feedback like yours and @therandomopera that helps us quickly improve the game. Things like “this game sucks. I quit.” provide us with no help. It is quite difficult to find quality feedback like the ones you two provide.
You should go rest, haha.
Well a quality game only deserves quality responses, so I’m sure you’ll get more detailed responses and suggestions. Plus, the active staff presence makes it way more encouraging to do so, specially knowing your suggestion/comment has been read and given thought. So thanks as well.
Have a great sleep, cheers.