Crushing Blow


#1

Conversation about Crushing Blow mechanics


Mid’s Guide on Damage Maximization [2.5]
Developer Q&A
Developer Q&A
#2

Are you sure? That wouldnt make any sense… Against those opponents who have lots of hp it would do nothing while it would shred through normal and magic enemies that die quickly anyways.
Some math: My bow has 2.6 attacks per second with 4 multishot. With 60% crushing blow that would equal 2.6×4×0.6=624% against one target

That would mean i can proc crushing blow against a normal target 6.2 times per second
Magic target 3.7 times per second
Rare target 2.2 times per second
Epic target only 1.3 times.

Keep in mind that this is only if that is the only target you are attacking! Shoukd the question below have “yes” as an answer that would increase the amount of times you can proc crushing blow (unless it does nothing) as arrows can pierce the same target multiple times.

On a sidenote: Can DoTs cause crushing blow? Can arrows that pierced a target cause DoTs on the 2nd and 3rd etc. target hit? What about mirror images? Can they proc crushing? (You should really add a training dummy in a future patch so I can answer such questions myself >.<

Also, concerning pierce: If it goes through an opponent and hits another one, does it have a chance to apply onhit?


#3

There was a typo in my formula, sorry :slight_smile: I meant percent of damage, not chance.

It’s:
Actual Percent of Damage = Crushing Blow Percent ^ Rarity Level
Where Crushing Blow Percent = .25
In PvP, the Rarity Level of other players is 3

Yup, Crushing Blow is checked at the same time Crits are.

Each new target it hits will trigger onhit


The Question Thread
#4

I assume you mean crushing blow% / 100% in the formula above.

Huh? That would mean that crushing blow is useless against magic, rare and epic opponents… That would make it even more useless than in the model calculation I did.

Assuming we have 2.6 as and 4 multi, that is roughly 10 onhit chances per second against one target. (Unless the arrow pierces it and hits it again (Assuming a single target would be pierced by one arrow 5 times, it would have the chance to cause cruahing blow 5 times, am I right?) causing another crushing blow.)

For the sake of demonstration, lets just assume that is true and every arrow pierces the same target 5 times. That would mean you have 50 chances in one second to cause crushing blow. With 60% crushing blow that equals 30 crushing blows per second.

Now to your formula. That would mean that you cause crushing against a normal enemy you would cause crushing blow 1 in 4 attacks.
(1/4)*30=7.5 crushing blows per second, lets say 8 for easier calculation.
Against magic that number is reduced to 2 crushing blows per second (cps)
Against rare only 0.5 cps
Against epic 0.125 cps

That would mean you have to attack an epic enemy for 8 seconds to cause one crushing blow.

Is that right or am I just not getting this formula (I study engineering though >.<). Please explain it more precisely!


#5

Sorry, Crushing Blow Percent is the amount of health taken, not the chance of occurring. That’s what i meant to fix above. I’ll give an example using real numbers, this should clear it up.

Let’s say you’re fighting a normal enemy ( rarity level = 1 ):
Crushing Blow Hits -> .25 = .25 ^ 1 -> Enemy is now at 75% Health
Crushing Blow Hits -> .25 = .25 ^ 1 -> Enemy is now at 56.25% Health
Crushing Blow Hits -> .25 = .25 ^ 1 -> Enemy is now at 42.18% Health
Crushing Blow Hits -> .25 = .25 ^ 1 -> Enemy is now at 31.64% Health
Crushing Blow Hits -> .25 = .25 ^ 1 -> Enemy is now at 23.73% Health

Eventually dead

Let’s say you’re fighting an elite enemy ( rarity level = 3 ):
Crushing Blow Hits -> .015 = .25 ^ 3 -> Enemy is now at 98.5% Health
Crushing Blow Hits -> .015 = .25 ^ 3 -> Enemy is now at 97.02% Health

Eventually dead after a long, long time


#6

You mean rare enemy.
That makes crushing blow absolutely useless…
An epic enemy would need 30 crushing blows to be dropped to 89% hp and approx 180 procs of crushing blow to drop to 50%. That would be 6 solid seconds of attacking for it to even drop to 50%…
You should really adjust the scaling to something like
Crushing dmg % = (current hp %)*(1-0.25^(rarity lvl/2))
or it would take you forever to kill enemies.
With that formula you would have to cause 11 crushing blows to get an enemy to 50%.

You would have to tweak the /2 at the end of the formula a bit (maybe to /1,5 or /1,4) but with the current formula it takes forever to even kill epics.


#7

Yup, we’ve historically used both rare and elite depending on the context, but you’re right I think I finally cleaned that up to be “Rare” everywhere :smile: “Rare League” and “Rare Difficulty” still sounds funny to me.

And yes, Crushing Blow wasn’t intended to be the only way you kill enemies. The danger is that if you have enough crushing blow, and it was useful enough, the actual damage you deal doesn’t mean anything.

Crushing Blow is meant to be a supplement, and mostly geared towards PvE.

If anything, I’d rather find some way to have it scale based on your damage or some other investment, but then it becomes just another form of crit.

*Edit: Moving this conversation to a new topic so we can focus on it without cluttering the Q&A thread


#8

ive already notice this in first week i play DQ. and in history of ke crafting thing, i never have intention of using crushing blow. lol


#9

Yeah but the problem is that crushing blow is effective against those enemies you oneshot anyways and against those where you actually need hp% dmg it clearly lacks. I mean, at f350 m3 it takes me 2 seconds to kill the cartographer. 5 if he GREATLY resists poison. That means crushing would become efficient only at around floor 800 or 900? When using the blughtbog saboteur that would probably make crushing blow stronger than the raw dmg of that build at floor 2000 m3?

Its just not viable anymore with all these brutally strong builds… At this rate it would be better to have a linear scaling like (crushing blow chance %) * 0.05 to do static 25% max hp dmg.


#10

my lohko not use crushing blow to 1 shot any player in Arena. lohko using direct damage multiplying that why the output always same or around there.

For PvE i use greengarden, also no crushing blow affix. in floor 350 m3. it kill carto less than 1 sec i encounter it lol. and still kill carto in less than 1 sec at floor 600+ m3. ofcoz ita greengarden full build. (not like the pne i post lol)


#11

Ok, lets do some more calculations.

@cronos4321 how much dmg does a tick of poison cloud do with all affixes on a crit to a single target (so without the plagued affect on multiple targets.)

@SteigerBox what’s the formula for monster hp? How much hp does an epic = rarity 4 monster have, depending on floor (without the difficulty modifiers (normal, hard, mythic 1, 2 &3)). I’ll do some more model calculations as I still think that crushing blow is a good mechanic, but is currently useless.


#12

idk lol. Number poping so fast, and alot.! how can i check that lol


#13

An estimate. Is it close to 100m? Close to 500m? Close to 1b?


#14

First blight around 100m.


#15

What is better? Crushing blow or Deadly strike? Shall i replace deadly strike or crushing blow with critcal damage or crit chance. Its unfortuante that I have two crushing bloe affixes on otherwise really good aftermath gear that I cant even remove unless i have to risk quartzing the whole thing.


#16

Crushing blow not so good affix tho. in pvp it almost like useless.

deadly strike only work when u have crit chance from affix or nature. coz deadly strike is chance for crit to become deadly. if u dont have crit chance. mean it imposible to land deadly strike, unless u are rogue and use vial, or u have coat proc.


#17

I have 60% critc chance though and also 225% critc damage. Is there a cap to critc dmg? My deadly strike is a standard 10% by mythstone. I wonder howe much deadly strike I really need?


#18

crit chance cap: 60
Crit damage cap: 360
deadly strike cap: 60


#19

Get deadeye on your amulet, the talent, it’s an easy 20% deadly strike right there


#20

Im not rogue so I cant do that.